The Manager Koorong Bookstore

Dear Brother/Sister and co-worker in serving the Lord Jesus Christ,

It is after much prayer and searching of my own heart that I feel compelled to write to you to discuss a sensitive matter. My purpose for writing is not to cause strife or enmity among us, nor to sow discord among the brethren, but rather, as we are encouraged to do so from the Scriptures, and in a spirit of concern for the Body of Christ, to bring to your notice some questionable materials that I have observed in your catalogues, that you seem, to all intents and purposes, to be unaware as you go about your daily business of providing literature and other goods to the Christian public.

In your position of providing literature to those seeking to come to a better understanding of God and His Truth, it could not possibly have escaped your attention that, particularly in the last ten or so years, great controversy has descended upon Christendom. The introduction of heretical beliefs, propagated by Rhema and Word of Faith teachers, into various congregations has been the source of much contention and division. More recently, the Toronto Blessing and Pensacola revivals have introduced more unbiblical teachings and have brought further division in the Body of Christ, as you are well aware.

Recently, I was encouraged to view the "Transformations" video and ordered a copy from a local Christian bookshop. Because of the delay in availability of the tape I happened to be in the store on a couple of occasions and had time to look around. I was dismayed at the number of publications, prominently displayed in the store, that are written by known false teachers who have departed far from orthodox beliefs and practices. Books and tapes by Word of Faith teachers and all the latest false revival teachers are readily available in the store. These same publications, written by heretical false teachers also appear in your mail order catalogues and on your website.

Grieving as that may be, I was further distressed to find, upon viewing the "Transformations" video, that it is produced by George Otis Jr. (a colleague of C. Peter Wagner) who teaches a heretical view of the Atonement. Reading from his own writings I quote, "Christ has not redeemed us by giving His life as a ransom for our sins in order that He might release us. God never kept man captive in sin. The truth is Christ paid no man's debt." Further, upon checking the validity of the claims made by the video, as we are commanded in Scripture to do (1 John 4:1), I find that there is much falsity and exaggeration. As well, I discover that the churches promoted in the video are Word of Faith churches or those which have been led astray by the current false revivals. One man displays a placard even, pronouncing that he is intoxicated on the blood of Jesus, a quote directly for the Rodney Howard-Browne "drunk on the new wine" revival.

Over the years, I have observed a trend in Christian bookstores to carry stocks of whatever is popular, despite their doctrinal content - materials that would cause a genuine seeker of Truth to be led astray. I am not speaking against the stocking of heretical books for the purpose of research stored in some unobtrusive place within bookshops, but I am concerned about the prominent displaying, advertising and sale of these types of books in a manner that suggests to the buying public that they are good wholesome literature that will edify the reader and glorify the Lord.

I would be interested as to what you would consider a solution to this problem that is occurring not just within your own organisation but within Christian bookshops in general.

I would appreciate if you could address this issue and look forward to hearing from you.

Yours in serving the Body of Christ in Spirit and in Truth.

Hughie Seaborn

----- Original Message -----
From: ---------- <----------@koorong.com.au>
To: R H Seaborn <rseaborn@ozemail.com.au>
Sent: Wednesday, 9 May 2001 15:40
Subject: RE: Questionable Materials

Dear Hughie,

Thank you so much for your email which I have just received. As you addressed it to ----------, I need to inform you that she is now based in Western Australia at our Leederville store. I am not aware if you are a personal friend of hers, or whether you sent this email to her in her capacity of being store manager of Adelaide. If it is your desire for her to receive this email please send it to her at ----------@koorong.com.au. This is her direct email address. If however you are seeking a response, not necessarily from ----------, but on behalf of the Adelaide store, then I would be happy to get back to you.

Kind regards,

----------
Administration Manager
Adelaide

----- Original Message -----
From: R H Seaborn <rseaborn@ozemail.com.au>
To: <----------@koorong.com.au>
Sent: Wednesday, 9 May 2001 20:31
Subject: Re: Questionable Materials

Dear ----------

Thank you for your prompt response to my e-mail addressed to ----------. I actually got the address for ---------- from your web site. I am not wanting to talk with ---------- personally unless she is one of the Koorong store managers. If you are a store manager or able to act on their behalf I would be pleased to hear from you personally about my concerns.

Thank you for taking the time to think about what is troubling me.

Yours in Christ's service - Hughie

----- Original Message -----
From: ---------- <----------@koorong.com.au>
To: R H Seaborn <rseaborn@ozemail.com.au>
Sent: Wednesday, 9 May 2001 15:40
Subject: Re: Questionable Materials

Good day Mr Seaborn and greetings in the Saviour's Name.

You have raised some very important points in your e-mail. I find that today the general Christian reader is less worried about the Gospel and salvation than they are about a whole range of other issues related to the Gospel or Salvation. One good brother of the past said that they are making a big mistake by making a goal out of a by-product.

It is interesting that the whole Toronto (et.al.) thing has run itself out in the desert. Revelation says that the earth opens up its mouth to swallow the great waters sent forth out of the mouth of the dragon and this will be the fate of all false teaching.

I have been a friend of the Bootes family for many years (they started Koorong and still own and operate it) and have seen it pass through many stages. All along I have had to realise that it is not mine to change though I do what I can to influence things. I also know that the Lord will guide His children into all truth. Over the years I have had to fight the various battles that face us all. Many of the great theologians have big areas of darkness (look at all the Presbyteries with their unscriptural doctrine of infant baptism) yet their works are wonderful on the whole. Todays 'latest' will be examined by the elect and they will suffer loss if they do not teach the truth as it is in Christ Jesus.

With things like 'Transformations' it is not hard ot see that there may be faults in it - but I am always encouraged by what the Lord actually does and leave the rest to be shown up by the light. I have learned the hard way not to run with every wind of doctrine and craftiness of men but has also learned that those who go after all this are impossible to turn to the truth and are better left to follow the latest thing until they truly seek the Lord Jesus and His salvation.

What we really need is for the Lord to anoint the true preachers to tell the truth and then the people will seek the truth and throw out the error.

Will go for now.

The Lord bless you.

----------.

----- Original Message -----
From: ---------- <----------@koorong.com.au>
To: R H Seaborn <rseaborn@ozemail.com.au>
Sent: Thursday, 10 May 2001 12:40
Subject: RE: Questionable Materials

Hi,

I understand that you have contacted a number if not all of our managers and that we have responded to your concerns. We are a team and one manager can speak for the company.

Thankyou for your comments they have been carefully considered.

----- Original Message -----
From: R H Seaborn <rseaborn@ozemail.com.au>
To: ---------- <----------@koorong.com.au>
Sent: Thursday, 10 May 2001 13:07
Subject: Re: Questionable Materials

Hello ---------- with greetings in the Lord.

Thank you for your quick response to my concerns. Also for your views regarding the problems with some of the materials available from Christian bookstores.

With regard to your quote: "It is interesting that the whole Toronto (et.al.) thing has run itself out in the desert." No pun intended I am sure but Rodney Howard-Browne will be conducting meetings at Alice Springs at the end of this month.

I am not sure what you are meaning to say in your above quote though. If you are saying that Toronto has run itself into a place where it has nowhere to go and will shrivel up and disappear I would probably disagree, up to a point. In my way of thinking, Rodney and the Toronto fiasco were but a vehicle delivering people to some other destination. He caused people to make a decision and take some kind of action. Most decided to go along for the ride. (But they have climbed off Rodney's bus and gotten on to something else. But make no mistake, Rodney's not finished!) A minority made a stand against Toronto and its manifestations and found themselves out of the fellowship and needing to take a serious look at their beliefs and practices. Obviously, there was something wrong with what they believed when it ended up in the kind of a mess that Toronto has been. For myself, I say, "Praise God for Toronto" in the sense that it caused me, and others like me, to get into some serious Bible studies to understand what was happening, and then stand firmly upon the Scriptures that clearly showed its errors.

I do realise that there are perceived problems with the different theological positions such as the Reformers and infant baptism, but we are talking here about outright denial of the Atonement by men such as Otis, Hagin, Copeland, et. al. They are in a different category to the Presbyterians, surely? These men are actually enemies of the Cross of Christ, and their writings and taped messages prove it. It is one thing to see Scriptures that somehow suggest infant baptism as valid, but it is quite another to deny that the Blood of Christ is sufficient to redeem us, in complete contradiction to the clear declaration of Scripture. All of the enemies of Christ attack the Atonement!!!

I can see by your response that you have been in this business a long time, and that you are aware of the problems. As well, I can also see that, perhaps for your own peace and good conscience, you have had to come to some understanding and solution to the problems I have raised, long before ever you heard from me. However, with all due respect, I am not sure that I can go along with the solution you have offered. It seems, from what you are saying, that we should just stand back from what is going on and simply allow the Lord to resolve the whole mess. I have to admit that sometimes over the last few years I have felt like doing that. Just walk away from it. I'd have a lot more friends, that's for sure. Perhaps you are right, and perhaps I am wrong, but it seems to me that we would need to disregard a good percentage of the Scriptures for your suggestion to be valid.

You said that you have learned "...that those who go after all this are impossible to turn to the truth and are better left to follow the latest thing until they truly seek the Lord Jesus and His salvation."

However, as I see it, that would deny Jude 3 and a host of other Scriptures that demand some form of action against false teaching and its promoters. Why would God bother to have things like Acts 20:28-31 recorded for our benefit if He was happy to simply let people follow after the latest fad?

I am just pointing out that I do see things a little differently than what you have suggested. I really do fail to see that Jesus and His disciples would have been involved in promoting His enemy's doctrines. Nor could I see Paul the apostle promoting and distributing the Pharisee's occultic writings after his conversion.

However, I do agree with your final comment on the subject though. It may be the only solution given the complexity of the situation. You stated that "What we really need is for the Lord to anoint the true preachers to tell the truth and then the people will seek the truth and throw out the error." However, this would of necessity require these true and Biblical preachers to warn of false teachers which, in turn, would mean pointing out the errors of people whose books are distributed by Koorong, Word, CLC Christian Bookworld, etc. But, at least that would be a start.

A Scripture that has greatly influenced my believing that we need to be proactive in defending Truth is Proverbs 24:10-12.

"If you faint in the day of adversity, your strength being small; if you hold back from rescuing those taken away to death, those who go staggering to the slaughter; if you say, "Look, we did not know this" - does not he who weighs the heart perceive it? Does not he who keeps watch over your soul know it? And will he not repay all according to their deeds?"

Unfortunately (I am not sure whether for myself or the false teachers), I have seen a great number of professing Christians staggering to the slaughter and I am obliged, in obedience to the Scriptures, to at least make some form of attempt at rescuing some of them.

Thanks once again, ----------, for at least taking the time to respond to my concerns and offer your views.

Yours in Christ for contending for Truth - Hughie

P.S. I am interested in your comment that you personally know the Bootes family who founded Koorong. Perhaps you could pass on to them my concerns, or, if appropriate, forward their address to me and I will write to them personally.

----- Original Message -----
From: ---------- <----------@koorong.com.au>
To: R H Seaborn <rseaborn@ozemail.com.au>
Sent: Monday, 14 May 2001 11:05
Subject: Re: Questionable Materials

Dear Mr Seaborn,

Greetings in the Saviour's Name and thank you for your reply.

I was not very clear in my first e-mail reply and maybe I will not be in this one either but I have had a think about what you have said and I will just give you a bit more detail on how I view the whole thing.

First, I was born again from a --------- and atheistic background into a strict fundamentalist church in ------. The Lord did not leave me long in this church even though I loved it and was grounded in the faith very soundly there and still love the people of God gathered there.

I was brought into contact with strong Calvanists and embraced this form of doctrine which I now fully embrace and love. I have also been brought into Koorong after 15 years as a ----------- in -----. This last experience has been the most challenging in some ways as I have had to have actual fellowship with a whole range of Christians that I have previously had my doubts about. I have had many hours of deep fellowship with these people and know their Christian lives as much as I know the lives of my older friends in Christ. I have found that this fellowship has made me think and pray through issues that I thought I had worked out long ago.

Not much has changed except my response to other professing Christians. I have had the experience over these past 15 years of actually being with three Christians of differing backgrounds as they died - all three had been gathered by Christ and have been victorious in their deaths - because at the end of it all they were all truly saved by His grace and their works followed them and their testimony to Christ though greatly challenged in each case, stood the rigours of death. Also during this time I have watched a young mother of 4 die of cancer, a fruit of my own ministry 27 years ago also victorious in Christ though she had embraced the Charismatic/Pentecostal ways - her funeral was a demonstration of the power and glory of Christ and challenged many there to turn form their sins and believe in the Lord Jesus Christ. Another beautiful woman is also dying of kidney failure and is also full of the grace and testimony of Jesus thought she has lived her life as a Baptist. Another old lady died in the comfort of Christ after a life as an Anglican with very little understanding of the gospel but instantly responded to the gospel of Christ when it was spoken to her as a self confessed sinner and I hope she is now in glory.

Also during the Toronto days I watched as some friends who had been steady Calvinistic Baptists all their lives suddenly change. They became evangelistic, tender hearted and kindly. They were nice people before but now they were special. They wanted to pray and do the Lord's work. They wept tears of repentance before us and were so different in many ways that I could only stand back and be thankful. Other things I did not like and still do not like.

What I am saying is that I do not feel the need to correct everybody about everything as I do not know everything. As I read in Galatians yesterday morning....."did you receive the Spirit by the works of the law or by the hearing of faith?''....and again....."He who does miracles (etc) among you does He do it by the works of the law or by the hearing of faith" (from memory so maybe not exactly word for word from the Scripture).

I believe that Koorng does a good work. It does not always do what I would personally like but then what I like and see today I did not like or see "yesterday". When the Lord brought me from darkness to His marvellous light He did not do it according to sound doctrine etc but by His will and power and since then He has taught me many wonderful things about Himself. I do not want to stand in the way of other sinners by my greater understanding - that is the real evil of the pharisies, this stopping others from entering the Kingdom by seeing them as unlearned etc. I would rather the compassion of Christ ruled than the perfection of Moses. This Otis man from Transforma tions may be a fake and an evil worker but when I watched that video I was greatly moved at the wonderful power of Christ to change lives and cause those who once cursed Him to now praise Him, love Him and embrace Him. I cannot see that I can do otherwise than rejoice.

Anyway, that is enough from me now. I hope that you will continue to stand tall and show the glory of the Lord as He has prepared it for you. I must continue to do what He has given me to do and we will await His final judgement with that fear and awe that it deserves.

Yours sincerely,

----------.

----- Original Message -----
From: R H Seaborn <rseaborn@ozemail.com.au>
To: ---------- <----------@koorong.com.au>
Sent: Friday, 18 May 2001 13:33
Subject: Re: Questionable Materials

Dear ----------

Thank you once again for making the effort to address my concerns regarding materials being offered from Christian bookshops, but it looks to me like we come from different ends of the theological spectrum. I can see that you have a big heart and a gentle disposition, ----------, which is bound to get you into a difficult situation one day, if you are not wary.

What you have written to me in your last e-mail proves absolutely nothing. You have related to me a number of emotional experiences that have had a profound influence upon you and have shaped the way you think about certain aspects of your Christian walk and, obviously, how you interpret Scripture. However, interpretation of God's Word and how we live our lives before Him is not based upon emotional subjective experiences, but rather, upon what God has to say upon these issues.

I am sorry to have to put it so plainly, but what does people dying have to do with the issue of propagating false teaching? Are you saying that because these people died in a particular manner that that proves they loved the Lord and were actually saved when they passed from this life into eternity? Then, how would you explain the numerous supposed near-death experience reports of a peaceful and blissful "going over" to the "other side" when these experiences are revealed to be of an occultic source when tested in the light of Scripture? Please understand that I am not saying that the people you have related about were not Christians, but I am saying that the way they died does not prove that they were Christians. The Bible makes it very plain who are Christ's followers and who are not, and it is only to the Bible that we should be looking when making these judgements.

In John 8:31-32 we find one example of who are Christ's disciples, where Jesus said, "If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free."

Paul was speaking about much the same thing when he wrote in his letter to Timothy, "Take heed unto thyself, and unto the doctrine; continue in them: for in doing this thou shalt both save thyself, and them that hear thee." (1 Tim. 4:16).

In 1 John 5:2-3 we read, "By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments. For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous."

It seems that I am not going to make much ground with you, ----------, if I complain on the issue of the Toronto Blessing. Obviously you are sympathetic to the movement when you can rejoice about people leaving the safety of the evangelical stream to come over and plunge into the raging, muddy rivers of the new revivals.

However, again, I need to point out that you are appealing to the subjective results as proof that what these people did was right, rather than the objective Word of God. These people became full of zeal and enthusiasm. They became "tender hearted and kindly". They wanted to pray. They wept before you. They changed. None of these things prove anything other than that they had some kind of religious experience. What kind of religious experience can only be judged by the Word of God, not by the experiences themselves. You say that you can "only stand back and be thankful" for what these people have come into (with your help, it seems).

I am greatly disturbed by your statement regarding George Otis and the Transformations video. You commented: "This Otis man from Transformations may be a fake and an evil worker but when I watched that video I was greatly moved at the wonderful power of Christ to change lives and cause those who once cursed Him to now praise Him, love Him and embrace Him. I cannot see that I can do otherwise than rejoice."

Again, you show your tendency to rely on subjective results, rather than the written Word of God, as your standard and guide in Spiritual matters. You even imply that it doesn't matter that George Otis may be a fake and an evil worker. What does that statement mean for the Spiritual safety of millions of young Christians who depend upon your supposed wisdom and maturity in Spiritual matters when they come into your shop in search of material that will cause them to grow in the knowledge of God? You mean to tell me that you would stock material that you know to be produced by enemies of God, so long as the end result seems to be good by your subjective estimation? So long as, in the end, people seem to be praising God and professing to love Jesus, who cares? And you rejoice!!! Think about what you have said, ----------.

Upon investigating George Otis' claims of cities being transformed, it is revealed that a great hoax has been perpetrated upon the Body of Christ, largely assisted by Christian bookshops, who have not bothered to check the claims of the video, but have passed them on as fact. Have you checked the claims of the video that you have been selling to the trusting Christian public? If you had bothered to do so, you would not sell it I am sure. Surely truthful and honest reporting must mean something to those who merchandise Christian literature?

I would like to give you one example of one of the cities that were supposed to have been transformed into some kind of Utopia by the power of the Lord. The city of Cali in Columbia. Would you please go to the following URL and read the news reports for this one city. You will see that there is still murder and mayhem, probably worse than before George Otis' supposed transformation. Bombs are still killing people. Murderers are still murdering people. Thieves are still robbing people. Nothing's changed, ----------. Will you please tell the people about this when they come in to your store to buy the video?

http://www.emergency.com/colbwarn.htm

Now let's talk about this power of Christ that changed the people's lives in Cali. Let's talk about the Christ these people praise, love and embrace. The people in control of the supposed revival in Cali are Word of Faith teachers. George Otis teaches, as I mentioned, that "Christ has not redeemed us by giving His life as a ransom for our sins in order that He might release us...The truth is Christ paid no man's debt." This is not according to the Scriptures!!!

George Otis is a great friend of C. Peter Wagner whose theological teachings are behind these "Citywide Transformations" that are supposed to be taking place. C. Peter Wagner is currently teaching that God is laying foundations for the Church in the 21st century based upon modern day apostles and prophets. He is actually endorsing a new foundation, based not upon the apostles and prophets with Christ as the Chief Corner Stone, but based upon the new apostles and prophets of the "New Apostolic Reformation" with himself installed as the chief apostle. And if you don't like it, he says, go find another church where you fit in. This, also, is not according to the Scriptures!!!

One of the key teachers of the Word of Faith doctrine, as you well know, is Kenneth Copeland. He is a great friend of Kenneth Hagin who also teaches Word of Faith doctrine. Hagin heads up all of the Rhema Bible Colleges, where people such as the blasphemous "holy-ghost bartender", Rodney Howard-Browne, were trained and indoctrinated with the same Word of Faith doctrine. Copeland and Hagin both teach that Christ did not fully redeem sinful mankind on the Cross of Calvary. Copeland even teaches that, if he had understood the Scriptures a little better, even he could have redeemed mankind! This, also, is not according to the Scriptures. I notice quite a lot of Joyce Meyer in your glossy, enticing catalogues. I am sorry to say, she teaches the same heresies about the Redemption as Copeland and Hagin.

We are warned in the Scriptures that there is another "jesus" who is preached that the people can praise, love and embrace. There is also another "spirit" that one can receive which can lead a person into a transformed, religious life style, into zeal to pray and read the Bible more. There is also another "gospel" that one can be "saved" under.

Gal. 1:6-9 should be a sober warning. "I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel: Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ. But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed."

According to this Scripture, those people just mentioned above, should be accursed. But are they accursed by any of the Christian bookshops throughout the land? No! They are held up in esteem and promoted and propagated and presented before the unsuspecting Christian book buying public as men and women of honour and integrity - as great scholars of God's Word who should be emulated and supported.

In 2 Cor. 11:2-4 we read, "For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ. But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtlety, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ. For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him."

You say that what really matters is that the people's lives exhibit change for the better, or perhaps that they pass from life into eternity in a certain way! Being ex-Roman Catholic, surely you know that even Catholicism can achieve that. Even the religion of the JW's can achieve that. But the Bible is very clear that it is not subjective experience that is the proof of the pudding, so to speak, but adherence to God's Word. God sets the standards in the Scriptures.

In 2 John 1:9-11, we read, "Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son. If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed: For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds."

Doesn't it concern you, just a little, that if all these people in Cali, and the other places depicted in the Transformations video, have been saved under another "gospel" then perhaps they might be worshiping another "jesus" and serving another "spirit" and are not really saved at all? "There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death." That concerns me. It concerns me when people, with good intention, take out an insurance policy, struggling to pay into it for years on end, only to be told in a time of crisis that they had the wrong cover or that some particular important aspect hadn't been taken care of, and therefore their claim is refused.

You say that God does not bring us from darkness to light according to sound doctrine etc (?) but by His will and power. Now, of course, your Calvinism is showing, and I will agree with you that Salvation is all of God, but it is also according to truth. Romans 1:16 says that the Gospel of Christ is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth. If you did not hear the sound doctrine of the Gospel then I must fearfully inquire of you, what did you hear? If sound doctrine is not an issue then what must we make of Paul's warning to Timothy, recorded in 1 Tim. 4:16 for our instruction? "Take heed unto thyself, and unto the doctrine; continue in them: for in doing this thou shalt both save thyself, and them that hear thee."

You comment that you "...do not feel the need to correct everybody about everything as I do not know everything."

Whether intentionally or unintentionally, willingly or unwillingly, you in the Christian bookshop business have taken upon yourselves the frightfully serious role of teachers within the Christian community. As the terms I have just used to describe the role of teacher imply, this function within the Body of Christ is not to be taken upon oneself in a casual manner, but should be a calling from the Lord, responded to only after prayerful consideration. In James 3:1 we read, "My brethren, be not many masters, knowing that we shall receive the greater condemnation." James was warning that not many should become teachers. Teachers are responsible and will be held strictly accountable for their teaching and its effects on believers. Therefore, as the ones committed with the task of instructing God's people to differentiate between the holy and the profane, they will be subject to greater condemnation in the judgment. This holds true for anyone who assumes responsibility for the spiritual welfare of God's people. James wants his readers to weigh carefully the responsibility of teaching others the Word of God as a serious and extremely responsible task that should not be entered into lightly.

Over the years I have noticed an alarming trend within the Christian bookshop fraternity to offer to the Christian public materials that are not just a little unorthodox, but which are outright heresy, and, in some cases, even blasphemy. We are not speaking here about the debates over doctrines such as Calvinism and Arminianism, or Pentecostalism and Evangelicalism, or the King James and Modern Translations, but we are speaking plainly about the promotion and propagation of materials that have been produced by people, who, by their recorded and verifiable statements (statements which are even contained within the materials that your bookstores sell to the Christian public), are enemies of the Cross of Christ. This is no small charge, I confess, but it is demonstrable truth!

I repeat, I am not speaking about your stocking of books and other materials that range from Reformed to Pentecostal. I am speaking of heretical and blasphemous materials, materials that are diametrically opposed to the Truth of the Word of God which are leading genuine seekers after Truth to chase after foreign gods. I am speaking about servants of Satan who appear as servants of righteousness being given opportunity, and even unrestrained assistance, to propagate their seductively packaged, poisonous wares among the unsuspecting and innocent people of God. I am speaking of wolves disguised as sheep being ushered into the sheepfold by sleepy shepherds who will not hearken unto the barking of the watchdogs.

I am not really that interested in debating about what I might think about this, or what you might think about that, but I am certainly interested in obeying the Lord's clear commands to defend the Faith against the heretics and blasphemers, such as the ones mentioned above, who don't even preach truth regarding the fundamentals such as Redemption or the Atonement. These people deny the fundamentals by preaching another gospel.

"Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood. For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock. Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them. Therefore watch, and remember, that by the space of three years I ceased not to warn every one night and day with tears." (Acts 20:28-31).

Paul was speaking here to the church leadership of his day and he speaks the same thing to church leadership today. Christian bookshops are in leadership positions, teaching positions to the Body of Christ. You have a responsibility! Paul warned that men, from within Christendom, will arise speaking perverse things. Wolves will enter into the sheepfold and rip the sheep to pieces. This is happening before our eyes. Are we concerned? Paul was so concerned that he continually warned the people day and night for three years. Paul was so concerned that he shed tears over the issue day and night for three years. How concerned are we???

The primary concern that I have with "Christian" bookstores in general is that young Christians are in grave danger when entering the bookshops because of the perception that, because the shops are called "Christian Bookshops", then the materials within the shop must be Christian in content. But this is far from the truth and, in my opinion and the opinion of numerous other discerning Christians, untold damage is being done. I have been confronted many times with this problem over the years, where a person has been converted to Christianity as a result of my evangelising efforts, only to become confused to the point of discarding the whole idea of continuing, simply because of the volumes of erroneous materials that are recommended for his reading. There is a never ending battle to be vigilant as to what the young Christians are reading and who is passing them what for their edification. It is part of the discipling process, I know, but of late, the amount of harmful material has become a flood that is near impossible to monitor. Where are all these materials coming from? The Christian bookshops, of course.

I have given but one example from the teachings of George Otis Jr., whose teaching of the Atonement, if accepted, would take someone to eternal damnation. His teaching is clearly a spit in God's eye regarding the atoning sacrifice of His Son on the Cross of Calvary for you and for me. I have great fear for George Otis, and for those many young people of YWAM who have come under his diabolical teachings, and for the multitude of people who have, and will, read his books, many of whom will purchase them from Christian bookshops like yours. I also have great fear for those who have taken upon themselves the task of disseminating his teachings. There are many more examples of outright heresy that I could provide, heresies taught by people and ministries that are vigourously supported by your organisation, but you say it is not your responsibility, You're not out to correct everybody, it's not your place to act as judge and jury about what should, or should not be offered to the Christian public.

Matthew 18:6-7 reads, "But whoso shall offend [skandalizo] one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea. Woe unto the world because of offences! [skandalon] for it must needs be that offences [skandalon] come; but woe to that man by whom the offence [skandalon] cometh!"

The Greek word, skandalizo, means to entrap; trip up; entice to sin or apostasy; make someone to offend.

The Greek word, skandalon, means a trap-stick - such as made from a bent sapling; a snare; a cause of displeasure or sin; occasion to fall or stumble; an offence; a thing that offends; a stumbling-block.

Jesus has plainly said that anyone who shall entice one of His children into sin or apostasy will be in dire trouble on the Day when we shall be called to account before Him. He also pointed out that people would come who would lead His children into sin and apostasy, who would place stumbling blocks before His children. These things must, and will happen. But woe unto them through whom it does happen.

Can you see from the above Scripture that you people who run Christian bookstores have placed yourselves in a position that requires that you must promote sound doctrine as found in the Scriptures? If you profess to be Christians, and you profess to run Christian bookstores then you are obligated by the Lord our God to promote sound doctrine and warn of false doctrine for the sake of His children, the ones He purchased with His own Blood.

While God is calling good Christian brothers and sisters in this day to stand and expose and denounce the heresies that are coming as a flood from a multitude of false teachers, Christian bookstores are at the forefront of undoing just about any good that they achieve. Not only do we have to contend with the world, the flesh and the devil, but with the Christian bookshops as well.

I see in your last e-mail that the veiled accusation of being a Pharisee was mentioned. As such, and because you are well versed in Calvinism, I thought I might mention one of J C Ryle's comments. He wrote in "Apostolic Fears":

"It is not the avowed Pharisee and Sadducee that we have to fear, but the leaven of the Pharisees and Sadducees. It is the 'show of wisdom' with which Ritualism is invested that makes it so dangerous to many minds. (Col. 2:23,) It seems so good, and fair, and zealous, and holy, and reverential, and devout, and kind, that it carries away many well-meaning people like a flood. He that would be safe must cultivate the spirit of a sentinel at a critical post. He must not mind being laughed at and ridiculed, as one who 'has a keen nose for heresy.' In days like these he must not be ashamed to suspect danger. And if any one scoffs at him for so doing, he may well be content to reply. 'The serpent beguiled Eve by his subtilty.'"

My prayer for you, ----------, and for your managers and their staff, is that you will take stock of your situation and what it is that you are involved in. We are not called to support false teachers and propagate their errors, we are called to expose them, warn people about them, and get well away from them.

"Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter! Woe unto them that are wise in their own eyes, and prudent in their own sight!" (Isaiah 5:20-21).

Yours in defence of Truth and the Gospel of Jesus Christ,

Hughie Seaborn

----- Original Message -----
From: ---------- <----------@koorong.com.au>
To: R H Seaborn <rseaborn@ozemail.com.au>
Sent: Thursday, 24 May 2001 15:44
Subject: RE: Questionable Materials

Dear Hughie,

Thank you for your reply. Firstly may I thank you for your correspondence. My apologies for taking so long to get back to you. We always appreciate our customers contacting us, especially if they have concerns and criticisms. May I also say that our company is run by a Christian family and our staff are Christians as well. However even in our staff there are considerable variations in our beliefs and our mode of worship etc, yet we all love the same Lord.

Koorong's Mission statement is as follows "To effectively promote and supply an extensive range of Christian books and other products that will be of spiritual benefit to the body of Christ. We uphold a philosophy of integrity, servant-hood and excellence in customer service".

We seek to adhere to that mission statement. Accordingly we supply to Christians of very conservative faiths right across the board to those who are much more contemporary. As long as an item is Christian and does not in anyway contradict scripture, or denigrate our Lord, then we will supply it. Staff who do the buying here are all committed Christians and they seek only to bring praise and glory to the Lord. They also seek to bring others to Him, so that they too may have eternal life. Should however something appear on our shelves which does not seek to do this, then it is immediately removed.

As Christians we are very diverse in our ways of thinking, praying, worshipping, fellowshipping etc and here at Koorong we seek to supply the needs of that very diverse group of people. Koorong too is a ministry, and we believe from the feedback we have received that we have a very valid and fruitful ministry into our community.

Thank you again for your concern. It is appreciated. We at Koorong desire only to bring glory to our Lord, to bring others into His Truth and to share the gospel out into our community here in Adelaide.

I realise that this explanation may not alleviate your concerns, but it is the only explanation that I can offer. I have also spoken with our Managing Director about your letter, and he is supportive of the explanation I have offered.

Yours in Christ,

----------
Administration Manager
Adelaide Store

----- Original Message -----
From: R H Seaborn <rseaborn@ozemail.com.au>
To: <----------@koorong.com.au>
Cc: ---------- <----------@koorong.com.au>; <west_ryde@koorong.com.au>; <blackburn@koorong.com.au>; <woolloongabba@koorong.com.au>; <leederville@koorong.com.au>; <adelaide@koorong.com.au>; <wh@koorong.com.au>; <port_macquarie@koorong.com.au>; <armidale@koorong.com.au>; <toowoomba@koorong.com.au>
Sent: Monday, 28 May 2001 14:53
Subject: Re: Questionable Materials

Dear ----------

Thanks for taking the time to respond to my e-mail. I was not expecting to hear from you personally as I was under the impression that the task of addressing my concerns had been given to ----------, who I assumed must be the national Manager of Koorong.

We have had some lengthy discussions on the subject of heretical and misleading materials being distributed to the Christian public by Christian bookshops. Unfortunately, it becomes clear that we don't really see things from the same perspective, so perhaps the matter is now closed - as far as any further dialogue on the subject between ---------- and myself goes, at any rate. Having said all of that though, I do appreciate you taking the time and making the effort to respond to me and also for giving me the opportunity to put my case, so to speak, to you personally as one of Koorong's bookshop managers. I also appreciate that you included your mission statement in your response to me. It helps to give us some guidelines to focus upon.

Firstly, I would like to comment on your statement that "Koorong...is a ministry." Of course, you would understand, and agree with me, that in claiming to be a ministry there are certain Scriptural obligations that we must recognise. The ministry that you have chosen to serve the Lord in is a teaching ministry. The Christian public look to bookshops and their staff as a valid extension of the teaching ministry of the Church. They see bookshop staff as people who they can come to for information that will assist them in coming into a better understanding of God and His Word. The stocks of materials available in your stores are presumed by the Christian buying public to be Truth as according to the Scriptures and honouring to God.

Being involved in the teaching ministry of the Lord's Church is no light matter. The ministry carries with it a fearful responsibility to teach Truth, which, I appreciate you have expressed is your intention. The Bible warns us in James 3:1, "...be not many masters, knowing that we shall receive the greater condemnation." The NIV puts it, "Not many of you should presume to be teachers, my brothers, because you know that we who teach will be judged more strictly."

James was wanting his readers to consider carefully the responsibility of teaching others the Word of God as a serious task that should not be accepted without prayerful consideration. No doubt, you are aware of all of this, and I would assume that you do take your ministry seriously. You must have some sense of responsibility, otherwise you would not hold the position that you do within the organisation.

Your mission statement reads that Koorong desires, "To effectively promote and supply an extensive range of Christian books and other products that will be of spiritual benefit to the body of Christ. We uphold a philosophy of integrity, servant-hood and excellence in customer service".

In my original e-mail I stated that my purpose was "to bring to your notice some questionable materials that I have observed in your catalogues" over a period of time. And that is still my purpose. In no way do I question your "integrity, servant-hood and excellence in customer service." As a business goes, you can't be faulted. My focus is to bring to your attention materials that you are offering to the Christian public that are not "...of spiritual benefit to the body of Christ." In fact, the materials that I mention in particular, I believe to be spiritually destructive to the Body of Christ. And that is my whole concern.

I heed the many warnings in Scripture that tell of a day when false teaching within the churches will be rampant. The warnings of teachers coming with false doctrines to draw away disciples to themselves and a time when the professing Christians will not endure sound doctrine but will prefer to gather to themselves a multitude of teachers that preach doctrines only to please them and make them comfortable in their erroneous beliefs. I believe strongly that we are well and truly in that very day. Those warnings in Scripture are being fulfilled in our time.

I see Joyce Meyer in your catalogues. Did you realise that Joyce Meyer (along with Kenneth Hagin, Kenneth Copeland, et al) promotes the Word of Faith and Rhema Bible College heresy that Christ did not fully redeem sinful mankind upon the Cross of Calvary? The Blood of Christ was insufficient, according to this misled lady who is vigourously promoted by the Christian bookshops. This is no small matter, ----------. Joyce Meyer's Word of Faith teaching attacks the very foundation of our Redemption and will lead people away from the God of the Bible into believing another gospel. She teaches heresy!!! If you are not aware of her false teachings or those of Copeland, Hagin, Hinn, Hickey and a host of others, please allow me to provide documented and verifiable proof of my claims for your sake, for the sake of your customers, and most importantly, for the sake of the Lord.

The Transformations video that prompted me to write to you in the first place is produced by George Otis Jr. (a colleague of C. Peter Wagner) who also teaches a heretical view of the Atonement. Reading from his own writings I quote, "Christ has not redeemed us by giving His life as a ransom for our sins in order that He might release us. God never kept man captive in sin. The truth is Christ paid no man's debt."

This is contrary to Scripture! We are not discussing here whether we believe in a pre, post or mid tribulation rapture or even no rapture at all. We are not discussing whether we should defend Pentecostal or Evangelical doctrines. We are speaking specifically about Christ not paying the price for our sins upon the Cross. This teaching is utterly destructive to the faith of any unsuspecting Christian who might be led to believe it. This man is an enemy of the Cross of Christ (as is Joyce Meyer). What does Scripture say?

In Romans 3:24-25 we read, "Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God."

The just demands of God's holiness for the punishment and exclusion of sin must be satisfied. Propitiation is the work of Christ on the cross in which He met the demands of the righteousness of God against sin, both satisfying the requirements of God's justice and cancelling the debt against sinful man.

Have you had your debt cancelled by the Blood of Christ? If you are born-again, of course you have. But George Otis, the man receiving much publicity from Christian bookshops worldwide, says that Christ never paid your debt. He says elsewhere that God is bloodthirsty if He required the sacrifice of Christ to redeem fallen mankind. What type of "Christian" doctrine is this? Yet professing Christians are falling over themselves to sit in this man's presence and hear his version of the gospel. And Christian bookshops are scrambling to get enough of his products to supply the insatiable demand that the slick advertisements have produced. And people like me get reviled and slandered and lose most of our friends for daring to point out this man's heresies and for trying to protect God's sheep.

I am pleased that part of your profession to me included that "As long as an item is Christian and does not in anyway contradict scripture, or denigrate our Lord, then we will supply it." As well as that, you said, "Staff who do the buying here are all committed Christians and they seek only to bring praise and glory to the Lord. They also seek to bring others to Him, so that they too may have eternal life. Should however something appear on our shelves which does not seek to do this, then it is immediately removed."

This gives me tremendous hope! Would you really refuse to sell something that "in any way" contradicts Scripture, that denigrates our Lord and fails to bring Him praise and glory, that could in some way be responsible for leading people away from eternal life? Without wanting to cast doubt upon the genuineness of your statement, I think you would soon be in trouble if you really were to follow through with your claim. Even though you might have the support of your Managing Director in what you have written to me, I think you would be looking for another job if you were to pull all of the Word of Faith and Transformations products from your shelves, products that can be proven to come within the categories you stated.

You made comment that "...even in our staff there are considerable variations in our beliefs and our mode of worship etc, yet we all love the same Lord."

I am not sure of the range of "variations" that you indicate in your statement, except that they are considerable. In these days of unity and love and breaking down walls of division, there is a very real danger of making our God all inclusive. Our God is not all inclusive and tolerable of variations in our beliefs if you are speaking of the fundamentals of our faith. In fact He is very exclusive, as is our Lord Jesus Christ.

Of course, as I have already said, I am not sure of what you mean by "considerable variations" but we need to be cautious that we don't create a god of our own imaginations who meets the criteria or requirements of the "considerable variations" needed for our unity to exist. This is a mandate of C. Peter Wagner and George Otis and other Latter Rain promoters and is not something that honours God, as you desire to do. These people and their agendas are preparing people for the soon coming "Babylon the Great", the apostate world religious system of the end-times. Again, my concern is that Christian bookshops, by their support of these heretical teachers, are at the forefront of bringing their agenda to pass. That is a serious charge I know, but it is the truth and able to be substantiated.

Like you said ----------, what you have taken the time to write does not alleviate my concerns but at least you responded with your views and allowed me to further explain where I am coming from. I do hope and pray that you will consider what I have said about these people and seriously evaluate your role as a provider of their materials. As one who takes seriously the command to contend earnestly for the Faith (Jude 3) and to turn Christian brothers and sisters from error to Truth (1 Peter 1:19), it would appear that I am working at odds with you and Christian bookshops in general. That is a sad state of affairs as far as I am concerned.

Thank you once again for your time and the Lord bless you as you seek to serve Him and consider the things I have written.

Please inform me if you feel you would like some of the evidence that I have regarding the Word of Faith and Latter Rain teachers and their heretical beliefs.

Yours in serving Christ in Spirit and in Truth,

Hughie Seaborn

----- Original Message -----
From: ---------- <----------@koorong.com.au>
To: R H Seaborn <rseaborn@ozemail.com.au>
Sent: Monday, 28 May 2001 15:45
Subject: RE: Questionable Materials

Dear Hughie,

Thank you for your reply. I haven't had a chance to read it all thoroughly as yet, but will certainly do so when I have time. I was not aware that you had contact with ---------- on the matter as well. ---------- is in fact the Regional Manager of Queensland and Northern NSW.

When I have had a chance to read your letter, I may get back to you sometime in the future.

Thank you again for your reply,

Yours in Christ,

----------

----- Original Message -----
From: ---------- <----------@koorong.com.au>
To: R H Seaborn <rseaborn@ozemail.com.au>; <----------@koorong.com.au>
Cc: <west_ryde@koorong.com.au>; <blackburn@koorong.com.au>; <woolloongabba@koorong.com.au>; <leederville@koorong.com.au>; <adelaide@koorong.com.au>; <wh@koorong.com.au>; <port_macquarie@koorong.com.au>; <armidale@koorong.com.au>; <toowoomba@koorong.com.au>
Sent: Tuesday, 29 May 2001 7:15
Subject: Re: Questionable Materials

Good morning to all who receive this e-mail and greetings in the Lord Jesus Christ.

Mr Seaborn, have you seen the Transformations video?

Also, are you aware that we do not sell Copeland or Hagen titles? Can you quote one sentence out of any Meyer or Wagner title, or have you ever read any of their material or seen any of their videos?

Thanks.

----- Original Message -----
From: R H Seaborn <rseaborn@ozemail.com.au>
To: ---------- <----------@koorong.com.au>
Cc: <west_ryde@koorong.com.au>; <blackburn@koorong.com.au>; <woolloongabba@koorong.com.au>; <leederville@koorong.com.au>; <adelaide@koorong.com.au>; <wh@koorong.com.au>; <----------@koorong.com.au>; <port_macquarie@koorong.com.au>; <armidale@koorong.com.au>; <toowoomba@koorong.com.au>
Sent: Thursday, 31 May 2001 13:33
Subject: Re: Questionable Materials

Hello ---------- with greetings in the Lord Jesus Christ to you and the other Koorong staff members.

Thank you for giving me the opportunity to speak with you again and to reply to your questions.

Firstly, you ask whether I have seen the Transformations video. Yes, I have viewed the video on quite a number of occasions. I bought my own copy after hearing that there were discrepancies between what was claimed by George Otis in the video and what a number of Christian researchers and discernment ministries were finding when, in obedience to the Scriptures, they investigated those claims.

In 1 John 4:1 we read, "Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world." Further, in 1 Thes. 5:21 we read, "Prove all things; hold fast that which is good."

When I brought my copy of the video home and watched it, I was horrified to see that the claims that I had heard about it proved to be true. For example, it has been produced by George Otis, a man who was responsible for introducing the heretical Moral Government Theology to a multitude of young YWAM students during the 1970-80s. I have already given examples of his erroneous belief regarding the Atonement. Nothing more needs to be added about Otis. The leaven of false doctrine is insidious in the extreme and our Lord Jesus specially warns His disciples to beware of it. God very clearly instructs us in His Word what we are to do about such a person as George Otis, even if he does preach some truth.

In Galatians 1:8-9 we read, "But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed."

Further, in 2 John 1:9-11 we read, "Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son. If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house, neither bid him God speed: For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds."

As a further example, as I watched the video I saw that the church of Thomas Muthee in Kiambu, Kenya, is a Word of Faith church. There is a big sign hanging right above the entrance to his church that says "Word of Faith Church". Being the pastor of a Word of Faith church we now know Thomas Muthee's version of theology. There is no difficulty in checking his affiliations and the source of his beliefs. They lead straight back to Kenneth Hagin and Kenneth Copeland.

Furthermore, as I watched the Transformations video I saw large groups of people "worshiping" the Lord in reckless abandon with much dancing and shouting and clapping and banging of drums and blowing of whistles and I recognised that this was one of the churches that was promoting the rivers of false revivals that have flowed out from Toronto, splitting many churches over the last couple of years. As if to verify my worst fears I saw a man wildly dancing about holding up a placard that announced that he was "intoxicated on the blood of Jesus". This poor, misguided man has been influenced by "another gospel" that is no Gospel at all. These words come directly from the theology of people such as Rodney Howard-Browne, the Holy Ghost Bartender, who blasphemously insults and degrades the Holy Spirit of God by inviting everyone to "belly up to the bar at Joel's Place" and "get drunk on the new wine". Rodney Howard-Browne, also a Word of Faith teacher, is a great friend of Kenneth Copeland, having been trained in one of Kenneth Hagin's Rhema Bible Colleges under the ministry of Ray McCauley at Johannesburg in South Africa.

Another thing that I noticed was that the video was intentionally deceitful in a number of places. By not telling the whole truth of a matter people were led by Otis into believing something that wasn't true. What am I speaking about? In the segment about the city of Cali, in Columbia, footage is shown about the death of Julio Ruibal, the pastor whose efforts were hailed as mostly responsible for the transformation of Cali. Due to the context in which this event is reported, it is implied by Otis that Ruibal was assassinated as a martyr for Christ by the drug cartels. But the truth of the matter is that Julio Ruibal was murdered by an irate neighbour with whom he was in dispute over property. Being killed by a neighbour with whom you are bickering over land is a far cry from being martyred for your stand for Christ and the Gospel, wouldn't you agree? Why wasn't this made clear in the video? I leave you to your own conclusions.

There are a great number of other things that I could mention, but the above are just some examples of discrepancies that come to light when the Transformations video is tested, or proved, in the light of Scripture and Truth. Our God does not require us to resort to deceit, lies and misinformation to convince sinners that they need a Saviour. The unadulterated message of the Gospel is God's way.

Now, my dear brother in Christ, without wanting to appear rude or disrespectful to you or your staff, I have a question for you. Have you watched the Transformations video? I would sincerely hope that you have seeing that you at Koorong have taken it upon yourselves to distribute it far and wide. Further I would ask, did you, in obedience to the Scriptures, check and see that the claims made by George Otis in his video, were in fact authentic? Or did you accept it at face value or at the recommendation of someone else? Did you make it your business, as a good Berean, to check and see if the things claimed by Otis be so?

I have mentioned this in my previous e-mails, but I repeat it for your benefit so that you can verify if George Otis has perhaps made claims that cannot be substantiated. Please go to the website URL provided below to get a current picture of life in Cali, Columbia. A city, according to George Otis, that has supposedly been transformed by the power of God. The link is to a research group in the US who are simply reporting the news as it happens in Columbia. They have no hidden agendas.

http://www.emergency.com/colbwarn.htm

If you will do a search for the word "Cali" in the document you will find that the city of Cali, Columbia, contrary to George Otis' claims, is still a city of exceptional violence and tragedy. Surely, upon viewing the evidence, you would have to agree with me that to suggest that Cali has been transformed by the power of God is nothing more than an insult to God and an opportunity for much derision and blasphemy to be levelled at the Church by His enemies?

Your second question is a little embarrassing for me, ----------. You have asked me if I am aware that you do not sell Copeland or Hagin titles. No, I am not aware of this. I was of the understanding that if I wanted Copeland or Hagin titles I could get them quite readily from Koorong. I am surprised that you are telling me otherwise. I would suggest that you log on to your website and do a search for titles by Copeland and Hagin. Before I gave up, I counted over 50 titles available, a good number displayed as "stock on hand" in your stores. How is it that you could tell me that you do not sell books by these heretical Word of Faith teachers? Also, a quick search of the site reveals numerous other Word of Faith authors whose titles are available in stock, ready for shipment. Besides Kenneth Hagin, and Kenneth Copeland and his wife, Gloria, I found such teachers as E.W. Kenyon (the instigator of the teaching that Jesus did not fully redeem us upon the Cross of Calvary - plagiarised by Hagin and passed on to his heir apparent, Copeland, who passed it on to others), Benny Hinn, John Avanzini, Ray McCauley, Jesse Duplantis, Oral Roberts, Creflo Dollar, Marilyn Hickey, Rodney Howard-Browne, etc., etc., etc., and of course, Joyce Meyer.

Which brings me to your third question of whether I can quote a sentence out of a Joyce Meyer or C. Peter Wagner book. Let me assure you that I have thoroughly "proved" and "tried" these two teachers in holy fear of the Word of God which instructs me to be sober, vigilant and watchful and to run the race in such a manner that I might obtain the prize.

Through my research and study of the Word of God I am satisfied that they both preach a "gospel" that is different than the Gospel that is found in Scripture. The "jesus" that they promote and profess to worship is a different Jesus to the One found in Scripture. The Holy Spirit is the Spirit of Truth and would not in any way contradict the written Word of God, and yet, the "spirits" that Meyer and Wagner promote both contradict the Scriptures.

In the fourth chapter of her book, "The Most Important Decision You Will Ever Make", Joyce Meyer teaches of the same "born-again" Jesus as that of Hagin and Copeland. She not only delineates and defines the heresy but she blatantly defends it (page 36 of the August 1991 edition; page 42 of the current edition).

In the same book, Joyce Meyer teaches that Hell is where our salvation was purchased, not the Cross of Calvary where the Bible so plainly teaches that Christ bled and died for you and me (pages 35-38, 41 and 43 of the August 1991 edition; pages 41-44, 47 and 49 of the current edition).

By placing faith in the "jesus" (2 Corinthians 11:4) as portrayed in Meyer's book, a new "believer" would not be entitled to the new covenant purchased with Jesus Christ's blood. Rather, the "jesus" that Meyer proclaims, is a "jesus" whose blood paid for nothing because his "blood was made of no effect," being "treated as an unholy thing" (Hebrews 10:29), because according to this teaching, Jesus' payment was actually made by suffering in Hell. This teaching makes the "It is finished" of John 19:30 into a lie. However 1 Corinthians 15:3 is very clear: "Jesus was crucified and died for our sins," not that He suffered in Hell for our sins.

Others committed to this teaching include: Fred Price, Charles Capps, Paul and Jan Crouch and John Jacobs (of The Power Team).

And Joyce Meyer's teaching on the Atonement is not confined just to her writings. Consider these statements on her audio tape, "From the Cross to the Throne".

"Jesus said, 'It is finished.' And He meant the Old Covenant. The job He had to do was just getting started. He really did the job the three days and nights that He was in Hell. That's where the job was done."

"He was pronounced guilty on the cross but He paid the price in Hell."

Blasphemy!!!

With regard to C. Peter Wagner, I quote from his advertising brochure for the National Apostolic-Prophetic Conference, which was held at Christian Outreach Centre, Mansfield, in Brisbane, during February 2000.

"The Church is changing. New names! New methods! New worship expressions! The Lord is establishing the foundations of the Church for the new millennium. This foundation is built upon apostles and prophets. Apostles execute and establish God's plan on the earth."

When you understand where Wagner is coming from, this is a frightening statement for all who truly are disciples of Christ. Wagner is steeped in the heretical teachings of the "Latter Rain" Movement. He is talking about "Restoration" of apostles and prophets for the Last-days church. He believes that God is laying a foundation for the church of the new millennium based upon contemporary apostles and prophets, with himself as the chief apostle, of course. Ministries are following after him as some magical Pied Piper. They are falling over themselves in droves to be included in his diabolical end-time plan. He is promoting a heresy that was denounced by the Pentecostal churches of America and Australia in 1949. He is resurrecting teachings, the only purpose of which is to lead the churches into a false unity that consummates in the great harlot religious system of Revelation 17 - that will be judged and destroyed at Christ's return.

Nowhere in Scripture does it even remotely suggest that the foundation that was laid at the beginning of the Church age would become obsolete and need replacing with another foundation, because the Lord is doing a "new thing". The foundation for the Church of the new millennium will be the same foundation that was laid, at the beginning of the Church age, by the apostles and prophets, with Jesus Christ as the chief corner stone. That foundation is already established, complete, set in concrete and needs neither replacement nor modification. Also, we the Church are to build upon it, not add to it. I feel extremely confident in saying that anyone who attempts to meddle with that foundation has not been ordained by the Lord to do so, no matter how strenuously he may declare that he has, no matter how expertly he twists the Scriptures to support his beliefs, and no matter how many professing Christians support him. He is grossly deceived and he is a usurper!

Finally you ask if I have I seen any of their videos. I have not watched Wagner, but I have watched Joyce Meyer on occasion. People tell me all the time that they watch Joyce Meyer and they can see no wrong in her teaching. I have to admit that she can talk for hours without seeming to put one foot out of place, but when you understand her underlying theology and her concept of the Atonement certain things that she says take on a different meaning. Those who are not aware of her roots see no obvious danger in her fruit.

But Satan is clever, and he is subtle. He's had thousands of years practice in deceiving people like us. We've been around a couple of decades and we think we are pretty clever and we can outsmart the Devil and his servants. And we can. We can be aware of his devices. But not of ourselves. Especially in these days of prophesied deception and seducing spirits and false teachings, we need to flee to the safety of God's Word. God tells us very clearly to get clear away from anyone who comes preaching a doctrine contrary to that which has been given in our Bibles. Have nothing to do with them. If they continue in their doctrine after being approached for correction, then don't even bid them the time of day.

The people I have mentioned in my e-mails to you have repeatedly been approached by Godly and concerned ministries and yet they persist in espousing their poisonous heresies. They refuse to repent of their errors. A great many of their errors are being spewed into the homes of gullible and unlearned baby Christians, daily, via TV. Their teachings are being lapped up by untold multitudes who are being led into following other gods.

My purpose in writing to you initially was to help make you aware of the false teachings that are being propagated by Christian bookshops in general. What prompted me to write was my frustration at the amount of error that was being propagated into the Christian community by well intentioned, but uninformed and zealous Christian bookshop staff. In the ministry that the Lord has placed me in I am repeatedly coming across young Christians who are persistently being exposed to erroneous teachers and led astray from sound doctrine. They are in danger of shipwrecking their faith by paying heed to the teachings of countless heretical ministries who are promoted as valid and godly by Christian bookshops.

My question is, "What, if anything, can be done to rectify this atrocious situation?" Are we simply just resigned to the fact that, despite both of us professing that we serve the living God of the Bible, that both of us claim to demonstrate our love for God by our obedience to the Scriptures (John 14:15, 21; John 15:10; 1 John 5:2, 3; 2 John 1:6), ultimately we are compelled, by our circumstances, to work against each other in our proclamation of the Gospel. Something doesn't quite add up, does it?

I close with a pertinent Scripture from the pen of Paul the Apostle.

"...what I do, that I will do, that I may cut off occasion from them which desire occasion; that wherein they glory, they may be found even as we. For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works." (2 Corinthians 11:12-15).

Yours in earnestly contending for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.

Hughie Seaborn

----- Original Message -----
From: ---------- <----------@koorong.com.au>
To: R H Seaborn <rseaborn@ozemail.com.au>
Cc: <west_ryde@koorong.com.au>; <blackburn@koorong.com.au>; <woolloongabba@koorong.com.au>; <leederville@koorong.com.au>; <adelaide@koorong.com.au>; <wh@koorong.com.au>; <----------@koorong.com.au>; <port_macquarie@koorong.com.au>; <armidale@koorong.com.au>; <toowoomba@koorong.com.au>
Sent: Thursday, 31 May 2001 14:34
Subject: Re: Questionable Materials

Thank you Mr Seaborn.

----- Original Message -----
From: R H Seaborn <rseaborn@ozemail.com.au>
To: ---------- <----------@koorong.com.au>
Cc: <west_ryde@koorong.com.au>; <blackburn@koorong.com.au>; <woolloongabba@koorong.com.au>; <leederville@koorong.com.au>; <adelaide@koorong.com.au>; <wh@koorong.com.au>; <----------@koorong.com.au>; <port_macquarie@koorong.com.au>; <armidale@koorong.com.au>; <toowoomba@koorong.com.au>; <----------@koorong.com.au>
Sent: Thursday, 14 June 2001 21:10
Subject: Re: Questionable Materials

Dear ----------

Greetings, once again, to you and the Koorong bookshop managers.

Two weeks ago, I received your very short E-mail (copied below). This E-mail was in response to the answers that I gave when you very pointedly asked me:

"...have you seen the Transformations video? Also, are you aware that we do not sell Copeland or Hagen titles? Can you quote one sentence out of any Meyer or Wagner title, or have you ever read any of their material or seen any of their videos?"

I think I gave a fair and adequate account for myself when answering your questions. In my response, however, other questions were raised which I do not believe were adequately responded to in your answer to me on 31st May, which simply said: "Thank you Mr Seaborn".

Be that as it may, I am very interested to know why it was that you were keen to have me informed that Koorong "do not sell Copeland or Hagin titles"? Obviously, you were mistaken about this, unless you purposely attempted to mislead me, which I do not believe you would do. You were honestly of the opinion that Koorong did not stock the writings of these two Word of Faith teachers. My question is, why were you eager about letting me know what you thought to be true? Could I perhaps suggest a reason? I suspect that the reason you were happy in your mistake that Koorong did not stock Copeland and Hagin titles is because you personally know that they are false teachers. You know as well as I do that these men, in particular, preach and teach a gospel that is foreign to the Truth of the Scriptures (as do most of their followers). Would I be right about this, ----------?

Another question that I must ask is this: now that you know, contrary to your previous understanding, that Koorong, as a company, does sell the heretical teachings of Copeland and Hagin, what are you, as a man of personal integrity and considerable influence within the Koorong organisation prepared to do about it? What are the other managers prepared to do about it?

In my last E-mail to you, as well as in my other communications, I have pointed out a particular teaching that is espoused and propagated by Hagin and Copeland, as well as other Word of Faith teachers such as Joyce Meyer. This teaching would have it that Jesus Christ, our precious Lord and Saviour, did not redeem fallen mankind upon the Cross of Calvary through the death of His Body and the shedding of His Blood. These people proclaim the most frightful heresy that Jesus was forcefully taken to Hell by Satan and his demons where He was tortured and tormented for three days, at the end of which God intervened, raising Him from the dead as the first born-again man.

Do you, or any of the other Koorong managers believe this diabolical lie, ----------?

I have also pointed out the heretical beliefs of George Otis Jr. His well publicised view of the Atonement is totally contrary to the Scriptures. He believes that Jesus paid no man's debt when He died upon the Cross. Do you, or any of the other Koorong managers believe the errors of this deceiver?

I would really appreciate your views about this issue, ----------. Do you, or any of your colleagues from the various Koorong Bookshops around Australia, believe that the above teachings that are being propagated by Hagin, Copeland, Meyer, Otis, et al, are orthodox, glorifying to God and beneficial to His Church, or do you agree with me that what they teach is heresy? If you agree that the above quotes by these false teachers are heresy, will you, or your manager colleagues remove their books and other materials from your shelves and catalogues as it was suggested by one of the managers you would?

I realise this is a big ask, but surely none of you would want to have to stand before the Lord on the day when we all have to give account and have to explain to Him why you were responsible for leading a multitude of people astray into prostituting themselves with foreign gods, because you sold the teachings of Kenneth Hagin, Kenneth Copeland and his wife, Gloria, Joyce Meyer, E.W. Kenyon, Benny Hinn, John Avanzini, Jesse Duplantis, Oral Roberts, Creflo Dollar, Marilyn Hickey, Rodney Howard-Browne, etc., etc., etc.

I would appreciate hearing from you with some comments regarding the above.

Yours in serving the Lord Jesus Christ.

Hughie Seaborn.

----- Original Message -----
From: ---------- <----------@koorong.com.au>
To: R H Seaborn <rseaborn@ozemail.com.au>
Cc: <west_ryde@koorong.com.au>; <blackburn@koorong.com.au>; <woolloongabba@koorong.com.au>; <leederville@koorong.com.au>; <adelaide@koorong.com.au>; <wh@koorong.com.au>; <----------@koorong.com.au>; <port_macquarie@koorong.com.au>; <armidale@koorong.com.au>; <toowoomba@koorong.com.au>; <----------@koorong.com.au>
Sent: Friday, 15 June 2001 11:25
Subject: Re: Questionable Materials

Good morning Mr Seaborn and all Koorong staff who may get this.

I did not want to go down this road with you Mr Seaborn because I do not want to argue every word and phrase with you, however here is a summary of the details and this will be my last answer.

1. I am not the general manager of Koorong and I never claimed to be or suggested that I was.

2. I have not been involved in the Toronto blessing, only an observer so you statement about this matter was taken out of context.

3. I have seen the Transformations video and did not see anything there to suggest that the person who put the video together was the major heretic you say he is. The video as it stands promotes the power of our Lord Jesus Christ and glorifies the Lord. Am I to take your word that this is all fake? And even if it is, then how much harm can come from people rejoicing in the work of the Spirit of Christ; even Paul rejoiced when his enemies preached the gospel only to cause him extra hurt in his imprisonment. If it was good enough for Paul it is good enough for me. Otis is not the Lord, if he had some evil motive in making a video that glorifies the Lord I am totally at a loss to understand what it is.

4. We do not stock Copeland or Hagen titles on our shelves or in our catalogues. The items we have on the system are for special order only - if you consider Mr Seaborn the number of people who watch and follow these two men (and their entourage) you will see that with 250,000 plus people on our mailing list that we do not promote these men. You will notice that most of the Copeland titles have SO as a code - that is they are Special Order only.

You see Mr Seaborn I doubt your sincerity with Koorong and myself. If you really wanted to find out what your Brothers in Christ really are doing you would treat us as brothers and not as enemies - and you would not bring us before your own bar of justice as if we somehow had to give you an account. Your whole tone shows that you consider us guilty before being tried and that is why you continue to twist all we say as if trying to squeeze a confession of wrong doing out of us.

I would never promote material that deliberately denigrates the Lord Jesus Christ and His gospel ( the very gospel of my salvation) and neither would any of the staff of Koorong. You have brought up some weird teachings of some Tele-evangelists and tared us with the same brush. I am not aware that we stock any books that would promote the horrible doctrines that you have accused us of.

Your previous e-mails caused me a great deal of anxiety as you were determined to force your accusations upon Koorong and me by association. I consider your attack as unwarranted and evil. Have you never read, 'who shall lay anything to the charge of God's elect, it is God who justifies." On that great day of God, the crucifixion of our Lord Jesus, I was acquitted for ever form the curse of the Law. I was excused form the sins I had committed, do commit or will commit by the precious blood of Christ and so are all my Brothers and sisters in Christ...... "if we walk in the light as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another and the blood of Christ cleanses us from all sin." I do not have fellowship with those who do not walk in the light - when I hear their words I know that they do not have the unction of the Lord's Spirit even though they have thousands following them. This is the legacy of every child of God. If a person does not have this unction form the Holy One then they will not discern and they will not ever know the truth no matter how many or what type of book they read. I have all sorts of customers in all sorts of spiritual states and conditions, the Lord must guide them into all truth and they are not all ready for the same things. I personally do not see what they get out of Joyce Meyer, but that is not my responsibility, she is a great help to many truly born again people, but I would not call her a great theologian, she give more practical advise to certain types of people.

Anyway, I think I have covered everything, at least superficially. I really have no more to say and I would appreciate it that you accept this as my final answer.

Yours sincerely,

----------.

----- Original Message -----
From: R H Seaborn <rseaborn@ozemail.com.au>
To: ---------- <----------@koorong.com.au>
Cc: <west_ryde@koorong.com.au>; <blackburn@koorong.com.au>; <woolloongabba@koorong.com.au>; <leederville@koorong.com.au>; <adelaide@koorong.com.au>; <wh@koorong.com.au>; <----------@koorong.com.au>; <port_macquarie@koorong.com.au>; <armidale@koorong.com.au>; <toowoomba@koorong.com.au>; <----------@koorong.com.au>
Sent: Tuesday, 19 June 2001 21:33
Subject: Re: Questionable Materials

Dear ----------

Thank you for your e-mail of Friday, 15 June, in which you provided a summary of how you see the progress of our discussion to this date. I realise that you have said that you have given your "last answer" regarding my concerns about what I see as questionable materials being propagated by Christian bookshops. I also realise, by the tone of your last e-mail, that you are perhaps a bit tired of my persistent questions and complaints. Please forgive me for my determination to see this issue resolved, one way or another, and for causing you "a great deal of anxiety" in the process because of my "accusations upon Koorong and [you] by association."

You have outlined a number of points in your e-mail that I would like to consider with you.

Firstly, you have pointed out "I am not the general manager of Koorong and I never claimed to be or suggested that I was."

My understanding about your position with the company was the result of an answer that I received from one of the other managers in response to my original e-mail, in which she said "I understand that you have contacted a number if not all of our managers and that we have responded to your concerns. We are a team and one manager can speak for the company."

As you were the person who responded to me I assumed, from the above, that you were the one with the responsibility to speak for the company. My understanding was based, as well, upon your close association with the Bootes family over many years. ---------- from the Adelaide shop eventually put me in the picture regarding your position within the company though. However, I don't really see what the issue is. Whether you are a district manager or the national manager, it doesn't really make that much difference as far as I see it. You are a man of authority and influence within the company - exactly as I understood you to be. What is the problem?

Secondly, you said, "I have not been involved in the Toronto blessing, only an observer so you statement about this matter was taken out of context."

Where have I ever said that you have been involved in the Toronto Blessing? How have I taken you out of context as you say I have? I have merely suggested that you were sympathetic toward the Toronto Blessing due to your rejoicing that some friends of yours came out of an Evangelical church and got caught up in this false revival. No one could rejoice about people coming into this movement without being positive about it in some way, surely? I have not said that you have been INVOLVED in the Toronto Blessing though. Where have I taken you out of context?

Thirdly, you said, "I have seen the Transformations video and did not see anything there to suggest that the person who put the video together was the major heretic you say he is. The video as it stands promotes the power of our Lord Jesus Christ and glorifies the Lord."

Perhaps you will not find anything that George Otis says in this video that would suggest that he is the heretic that I (and numerous other discerning Christians) say he is. Perhaps you see nothing wrong with the promotion of the extra-biblical teachings of "spiritual mapping". Where is this practice, that is currently sweeping the world, mentioned in Scripture? Have you not read 1 Corinthians 4:6, where Paul tells us not to exceed or go beyond what is written? Perhaps, also, you see nothing odd about the engaging of demonic spirits and powers in "strategic level spiritual warfare" in direct contradiction to God's instructions in Jude verses 8 to 10. 1 John 5:2 tells me that "by this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments."

Regarding your comment that the video glorifies the Lord, I would have to ask you, "Which Lord?" Wouldn't you think that a one hour video production that glorifies the Lord Jesus Christ would have something to say about sin? After all, from what I understand, that's why He suffered an extremely horrible death upon the Cross of Calvary. The word, "sin", gets one or two casual mentions in the entire video which depicts four separate locations that have supposedly been transformed, ----------. There's plenty of talk about drug cartels and witches being run out of town, and the like, but no mention of people being saved and set free from their sins. Matthew 1:21 tells me that Jesus "shall save his people from their sins." If this Transformations video was glorifying to the Lord Jesus Christ, surely you would hear about this happening. But it's not mentioned!!!

What about Christ's precious Blood that He spilt on our behalf that we might be redeemed to God? Not even mentioned that I could hear. All I saw was one man waving a placard proclaiming that he was "intoxicated in the Blood" of Jesus, as though Christ's precious Blood was some common thing. Do you really think that poor man will be so joyfully waving his placard about when he has to stand before Christ? That's why I'm concerned, ----------. If I could personally meet that man, I would make some desperate attempt to show him from the Scriptures why he should not make little of the Blood of Christ. He has been led away into error by false teachers!

Perhaps something like conviction of sin and repentance would bring glory to our Lord Jesus Christ. I did hear the word repentance mentioned only three times during the hour.

What about Jesus Himself? Is His Name held up in honour? No! The Name which is above all names is only casually mentioned a couple of times. Usually to endorse some deed that one of the featured pastors had performed.

What about the Gospel? The Gospel barely rates a mention except at the end of the video in the segment about Almolonga. Wouldn't you think that a video about the supposed spiritual transformation of four separate cities would have a fairly high mention of the Gospel? Forgive me for being a little suspicious, but I thought it was the Gospel that was the power of God unto Salvation for all who believed. Has it somehow become possible in these last days to be saved without the Gospel?

But then, there is plenty of talk about demons, the occult, witchcraft, etc. There is also plenty of talk about spiritual warfare, prayer methods, spiritual mapping, unity and the things that are being promoted by the Latter Rain and Kingdom Now false teachers, the group to whom Otis belongs. It seems to me that there is more glory given to the power of the good ideas of George Otis and his colleagues than there is to Jesus Christ, as you suggest there is. Sit down and watch the video again, ----------. You might be surprised.

Fourthly, you ask the reasonable question of me, "Am I to take your word that this is all fake?"

Absolutely not, ----------. Surely I would be a hypocrite to suggest that you take my word at face value after having quoted to you, at least once during our discussions, 1 John 4:1 where we read, "Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world." and 1 Thessalonians 5:21 where we read, "Prove all things; hold fast that which is good."

I am also a little concerned that you would suggest this of me after having provided sources for a number of the quotes that I have given you about some of the false teachers that Christian bookshops promote. I did give references for my claims regarding Joyce Meyer, for instance. Also, I provided for you an Internet link to a reliable source, giving substantiated evidence that proved most of the claims by George Otis, about the city of Cali, were false.

Fifthly, I would like to comment upon your quote, "And even if it is [all fake], then how much harm can come from people rejoicing in the work of the Spirit of Christ; even Paul rejoiced when his enemies preached the gospel only to cause him extra hurt in his imprisonment."

You said something like this before, ----------, upon which I have already commented. But I must ask, "Is the Holy Spirit promoted by lies?" Does God use dishonesty and false religion to bring people into fellowship with the Spirit of Christ, as you suggest? Does God use un-holiness to promote His holiness? This is modern thinking and has no place in Scripture, ----------. God is light and in Him is no darkness at all (1 John 1:5).

You have rightly said that Paul rejoiced when his enemies preached the Gospel. And therein is revealed the point that seems to have eluded you. His enemies preached the Gospel. They weren't preaching error!!! You erroneously infer that the apostle Paul stood idly and silently by while his enemies, and the enemies of Christ, promoted lies, dishonesty and false doctrines. You are grossly mistaken here, ----------. Read 2 Cor 11:12-15 and you will find just how much Paul tolerated false apostles and teachers.

Sixthly, you have stated, "We do not stock Copeland or Hagen titles on our shelves or in our catalogues. The items we have on the system are for special order only… You will notice that most of the Copeland titles have SO as a code - that is they are Special Order only." You also say that I "continue to twist all" that you say for ulterior purposes.

I don't intend to twist anything that you say, ----------. If I have twisted something that you have said out of context, then please make it plainly known to me and I will forthwith apologise. However, I must point out that you are inconsistent in your dealing with this matter of whether you do or do not promote Hagin or Copeland materials and I do not have to resort to twisting your statements to make my point.

In your e-mail of Tuesday, 29 May you pointedly asked me, "…are you aware that we do not sell Copeland or Hagen titles?" I went to your website and found that you did in fact have Hagin and Copeland titles in stock, for sale. You now come back to me and angrily assert that I have misquoted you and you question my honesty, my sincerity, and even accuse me of evil. Be that as it may, you have changed your original quote of "we do not SELL Hagin and Copeland" to "we do not STOCK Hagin and Copeland". Whether you stock them in your shop or not makes not one iota of difference to the FACT that you do SELL Hagin and Copeland to the unsuspecting Christian public.

You have said to me, "You see Mr Seaborn I doubt your sincerity with Koorong and myself." What am I to make of this? With one breath you say, "The items we have on the system are for special order only…" implying that all Hagin and Copeland titles are only available by Special Order (SO) and then, with the next breath you say, "MOST of the Copeland titles have SO as a code - that is they are Special Order only." Are they ALL Special Order? Or are only MOST of them Special Order? Forgive me for pursuing this, ----------, but there seems to be duplicity here. You see, I went back to your website and I found that quite a number of Hagin and Copeland titles were not classified as SO, as you so strenuously assert that they ALL are, and, in fact, there were even a good number of titles with "stock on hand" and available for immediate sale in various of the Koorong stores. I am sorry if I am a sticker for details, but something doesn't quite add up, you will agree? Why are you blaming me for saying that you do sell products by these people when all I get from your end is a subtle (but crucial) change in your statement and a website that thoroughly contradicts your claims? The evidence refutes you, ----------. Please do not come back to me with your claim that I have twisted what you have said. Go to your website and check properly!

Seventhly, you have complained about me, "If you really wanted to find out what your Brothers in Christ really are doing you would treat us as brothers and not as enemies."

I can understand your frustrations at my seeming endless moanings and questions, but I did come to Koorong in a gentle manner, as a Brother in Christ, requesting that something be done about the distribution, by Christian bookshops, of materials produced by false teachers. Go back and read my e-mails to you. Where is the lack of sincerity? Where did I treat you as an enemy? I am aware of 2 Thessalonians 3:14-15 which encourages us, "…if any man obey not our word by this epistle, note that man, and have no company with him, that he may be ashamed. Yet count him not as an enemy, but admonish him as a brother." Perhaps you have mistaken brotherly admonishing as a personal attack and "unwarranted evil"???

I took the trouble to write to you (not you personally, ----------, but Koorong) and made myself unpopular by pointing out the un-Biblical teachings and heresies espoused by people like Joyce Meyer, Hagin, Copeland, Kenyon, Otis, Wagner, et. al., and rather than checking to see if what I am saying has any substance to it, you come out defending the false teachers and question my motives and integrity. I would have thought that you, and Koorong as a company, would be pleased to receive the information that I gave about these people so you could do something about it, but I receive a response (your e-mail, Wednesday, 9 May) that tells me that "the earth opens up its mouth to swallow the great waters sent forth out of the mouth of the dragon and this will be the fate of all false teaching", as though to say, "She'll be right, mate! Let evil continue that Grace may abound." Well, unfortunately, as we continue to waste precious time contending back and forth here, a lot more of my friends, as well as other brothers and sisters in the Lord whom I have never met, will have been influenced by the teachings of these people that I have been continually referring to.

And I grow more concerned as each day passes by, but I have not resorted to treating you, or anyone else who has responded to my concerns, as I would an enemy.

Eighthly, allow me to respond to your charge that, "You have brought up some weird teachings of some Tele-evangelists and tared us with the same brush."

Where have I done that? I have certainly asked whether you, or any of the other shop managers believe the doctrines of these false teachers, but nowhere will you be able to substantiate your charge that I have accused you of believing their doctrines. I have accused you of propagating them though, which is the whole point of my discussion with you, but I have not accused you of believing them. The point of my question was not to get some confession out of you that you do believe what these dreamers teach, but to find out what you were going to do about selling their materials, knowing full well that you did not agree with their teachings. And I will continue to ask that question, whether you will answer me or not.

Also, your attitude about what I have charged these false teachers with, as though it is just "some weird" trivial error that is being promoted by "some Tele-evangelists" amazes me. The some "weird teachings" happens to involve the very foundational doctrine of our Redemption. The sufficiency of Christ's death upon the Cross and the sufficiency of the Blood of Christ to cleanse all sin and redeem us to God. As well as that, the "some Tele-evangelists" that you so casually mention just happens to be some of the most influential and highly promoted preachers and teachers in the world today.

You say, "I am not aware that we stock any books that would promote the horrible doctrines that you have accused us of." I have not accused you of the "horrible doctrines" but of the promotion and positive exposure of the teachers of these "horrible doctrines". But why don't you go and have a read of some of the books by Hagin, Copeland and Meyer that you have in stock. Test what you read in them against the Scriptures. I am amazed at what a risky business you find yourself in - the selling of mountains of books, the contents of which you are mostly ignorant.

However, in this day of information overload, it is not too difficult to obey the command of the Lord to test all things - to try against the Scriptures the teachings of the multitude of professed teachers that now swarm throughout the congregations of the world. You have access to the Internet. There are scores of good search engines available with which to find almost any information. It is a simple task to type in a few key words and get information. I suggest you take a little time to thoroughly check some of the people I have mentioned. For your sake, and the sake of your customers.

I do not question your sincerity, ----------, but if you think so highly of the Blood of Christ as you profess you do by your statement, "I was excused form the sins I had committed, do commit or will commit by the precious blood of Christ and so are all my Brothers and sisters in Christ…" then why do you see fit to sell the products of teachers who trample the precious Blood of Christ underfoot? Why do you not take seriously the command of the Lord in Jude 3 to contend earnestly for the Faith? Why do you seem so keen to prove to everyone that I am just some hollow noise that will soon subside while the enemies of the Atoning work of our Lord Jesus Christ receive a place of prominence and positive exposure upon the shelves of your so-called Christian bookshops?

You may consider my concerns as an "attack" and as "unwarranted and evil", but I assure you, ----------, I won't have to stand before the Lord on that Day and answer why I promoted the materials (for profit) of the false teachers He specifically warned me about in His Word. Perhaps I will have to give account for being a little forthright when obeying His clear command to defend His Word and the purity of the Gospel, but I won't have to answer for making naught of His sacrificial death and the Blood He shed on my behalf. Hopefully, neither will I have to give account for leading one of His "little ones" astray.

Hopefully, neither will you or the other Koorong staff.

Please find below some links to articles that give sources for my claims regarding the false teachers I have mentioned in my transactions with you. Please read them and check out the claims for yourself.

Yours in Christ for defending His Truth.

Hughie Seaborn.

LINKS:

Joyce Meyer:
http://www.discernment.org/Charismania/joyce.htm

George Otis:
http://www.ozemail.com.au/~rseaborn/george_otis_teachings.html
http://www.bibleguide.com/articles/english/transformations1.htm
http://www.bibleguide.com/articles/english/transformations2.htm

E W Kenyon
http://www.iclnet.org/pub/resources/text/cri/cri-jrnl/web/crj0118a.html

C. Peter Wagner:
http://www.ozemail.com.au/~rseaborn/New_Apostolic_Reformation.html

Kenneth Copeland:
http://www.iclnet.org/pub/resources/text/cri/cri-jrnl/web/crj0119a.html

Kenneth Hagin:
http://www.discernment.org/Charismania/kenneth.htm

----- Original Message -----
From: R H Seaborn <rseaborn@ozemail.com.au>
To: ---------- <----------@koorong.com.au>
Cc: <west_ryde@koorong.com.au>; <blackburn@koorong.com.au>; <woolloongabba@koorong.com.au>; <leederville@koorong.com.au>; <adelaide@koorong.com.au>; <wh@koorong.com.au>; <----------@koorong.com.au>; <port_macquarie@koorong.com.au>; <armidale@koorong.com.au>; <toowoomba@koorong.com.au>; <----------@koorong.com.au>
Sent: Wednesday, 4 July 2001 11:44
Subject: Koorong June Sale

Dear ---------- and Managers of Koorong Bookshops,

Greetings in the Name of the Lord Jesus Christ.

I have received news of your "15% off everything in stock" sale that began on Monday 25th of June and finished on Saturday 30th of June.

If you would please endure with me further for a moment of your valuable time I would like to express once again my concerns that Christian Bookshops, including Koorong, whether intentionally or unintentionally, knowingly or unknowingly, are holding up in high esteem and promoting in the Christian community, false teachers and their erroneous teachings. My contention is that by the promotion of these false teachers, genuine seekers of the Truth are being led astray to follow after false gods.

I would like to bring to your attention, to further substantiate the claims that I have been making to you over the last two or so months, just one example, in particular, from this June sale advertisement.

Your advertisement encourages the people of God to visit your Koorong stores, for, you claim, "this is the perfect time to come in and purchase great new books including the best selling "Prayer of Jabez" and other best selling titles from authors such as Max Lucado, Philip Yancey and John Maxwell."

Lucado, Yancey and Maxwell aside, I would like to ask if any of you managers know anything about the character of Bruce Wilkinson, the author of the "great new" "best selling" book, "The Prayer of Jabez", or whether you have even read what it is that you are promoting for the "spiritual benefit of the Body of Christ"?

This book is written by a man who has no qualms about promoting ecumenism. In fact, by his involvement with the controversial and ecumenical men's movement, Promise Keepers, he has been directly active in promoting unity between Protestants and Roman Catholics (at the expense of sound doctrine) and helping to fulfil Satan's plan to undo the liberating work that God brought about through the Reformation. (I take it that you do know of the Reformation and what it was about?). This false unity, which is based upon man's lies rather than God's Truth, will ultimately culminate in the joining together of all religions under the umbrella of the Roman Catholic Church to form the cursed great harlot religion, Babylon the Great of Revelation 17, which God describes as the "Abominations of the Earth" and which He promises to utterly destroy.

My question is, "Why would a Christian bookshop, the mission statement of which includes the claim that it's aim is 'to effectively promote and supply an extensive range of Christian books and other products that will be of spiritual benefit to the body of Christ', so desire to promote such a man as Wilkinson who is obviously deceived about the nature and purposes of God?"

Unfortunately, what Wilkinson has written in his little book, The Prayer of Jabez, is well suited to cater to the members of the apostate church of the last-days. We are clearly warned in Scripture (2 Timothy 3:1) that at the closing of the Church Age (the age in which we currently find ourselves) "perilous times" shall come. These perilous and dangerous times, which SHALL come, will be the result of a number of prevailing conditions. The very first condition that Paul, under the prophetic inspiration of the Holy Spirit, warns of is this: "For men shall be lovers of their own selves!" What Mr Wilkinson has done, along with a multitude of other false teachers, who have also risen from among the professing churches, is, he has found a way to cater to the prophesied love of self that God warns will prevail in the last-days. And he has now become quite "successful" and his "great new" book has become a "best seller" thanks to the help he gets from Christian bookshops, Koorong being well and truly among them.

In the Preface to his book, Bruce Wilkinson claims, "I want to teach you how to pray a daring prayer that God always answers. It is brief - only one sentence with four parts - and tucked away in the Bible, but I believe it contains the key to a life of extraordinary favor with God. This petition has radically changed what I expect from God and what I experience every day by His power. In fact, thousands of believers who are applying its truths are seeing miracles happen on a regular basis."

Without going any further into the book, alarm bells should now be ringing in the ears of those who truly want to serve God and walk according to His Word. According to Wilkinson, God ALWAYS answers this prayer that he discovered in 1 Chronicles 4:9-10. He also says that this little prayer is THE KEY to extraordinary favour with God. People, who have taken hold of Wilkinson's formula for success, and who have applied it in accordance with his teaching, are seeing MIRACLES on a regular basis. All the result of repeating an obscure little prayer from the Old Testament.

Without getting into too much discussion over whether God MUST always answer ALL our prayers, whether Wilkinson has found THE magical key, or whether it is a good thing for a wicked and adulterous generation to seek after miracles, the miracle of Jabez Prayer, that we can claim for our own lives, according to Wilkinson, is based upon the formula that he stumbled upon when he said this little prayer, word for word, every day, for thirty years. You pray the Jabez prayer, word for word, every day, and, "Rejoice!!" Instant success.

I am sorry to have to say that the message of this little book is simply another form of the "name it and claim it" prosperity teaching that has been infecting the church for the last few decades. The readers are being offered a prescription for success, in all aspects of their lives, by praying a daily prayer according to a formula. However, I think the unwary lover-of-self should be cautioned that Jabez did not continually pray this prayer, day in and day out, year after year throughout his lifetime to obtain favour from God. He prayed once! The Scripture tells us that Jabez was more honourable than his brethren. He was a righteous man who feared the God of Israel, whom he called upon in prayer. Very simple really.

"Commit thy way unto the Lord; trust also in Him; and He shall bring it to pass." "In all thy ways acknowledge Him, and He shall direct thy paths."

No need to find some secret formula and apply it day by day, year by year. The prayer that Jabez prayed is merely an example of God providing for and caring for His chosen people and keeping his covenant with them according to the Old Testament Law. Jabez did not stumble across some secret formula, which he applied day after day, but simply walked in God's revealed Truth. God, in His sovereignty, answered him. The focus of Jabez's prayer is on God and His provision and protection. God did not answer Jabez's request because he found the right formula or because he prayed this prayer repetitively for thirty years.

Mr Wilkinson advocates, however, that is exactly what we should do, if we want blessings and favour from our God. On page 86 of his book he writes, "I challenge you to make the Jabez prayer FOR BLESSING part of the daily fabric of your life. To do that, I encourage you to follow unwaveringly THE PLAN outlined here for the next thirty days. By the end of that time, you'll be noticing significant changes in your life, and the prayer will be on its way to becoming a treasured, lifelong habit."

It's got a sort of a Demtel telemarketing feel to it, hasn't it? "If you'll just try this exciting new diet formula, follow unwaveringly the plan outlined here for the next thirty days and make it a part of the daily fabric of your life, you and all your friends will be noticing significant changes or we'll give you your money back - no questions asked." At least Demtel are honest enough to offer your money back if the plan doesn't work according to the product's confident claim. What about Wilkinson?

It's also got a sort of a Roman Catholic feel about it as well, don't you think? "Take your Rosary Beads and say twenty Jabez prayers for the next thirty days and God is obligated, without fail, to bring to pass all your requests and dreams to abundantly bless your already self-indulgent life."

Some more quotes from the book that should cause alarm for genuine followers of God's Word. On page 87, we read, "…reread this little book once each week during the next month, asking God to show you important insights that you may have missed…You can hang the Jabez prayer on the wall of every room in your house and nothing will happen. It's only WHAT YOU BELIEVE WILL HAPPEN and therefore DO NEXT that will RELEASE GOD'S POWER for you and bring about a life change."

This kind of reasoning comes directly out of the Metaphysical cults of Kenyon, Hagin, Copeland, et. al., as discussed in previous e-mails.

On page 25 of The Prayer of Jabez, we read, "Suddenly the unhindered forces of heaven can begin to accomplish God's perfect will - through you. And you will be the first to notice!"

What pride! What arrogance! Another clear example of perilous times. Wilkinson is catering to man's love of self. Surely we have enough trouble recognizing pride and keeping it in check so that it doesn't destroy our ministry integrity without the teaching of what Wilkinson promotes here. Proverbs 16:18-19 reads, "Pride goeth before destruction, and an haughty spirit before a fall. Better it is to be of an humble spirit with the lowly, than to divide the spoil with the proud."

On page 49, however, it does seem like Wilkinson is back on the right track, where he says, "You do not become great; you become dependent on the strong hand of God." But he is swiftly off the rails again by going on to say, "Your surrendered need turns into His unlimited opportunity."

God's unlimited opportunity, folks, is His obligation to answer your self-serving prayer request based upon your having repeatedly prayed, for thirty days, the prayer that Jabez prayed once.

Wilkinson's closing statement in this paragraph should be evidence enough to warn all your friends not even to touch the book, but to flee from the wrath to come. He says, "And He becomes great through you." God becomes great through me, or you??? You've got to be kidding!!! God's greatness is not dependent upon you, or me, or Wilkinson, or anyone else. What arrogance and self-aggrandizement to suggest that a mere human can somehow add to God's greatness. I can just see Mr Wilkinson standing before God on the day we give account, with all the gullible people who got drawn in by his teachings, trying to convince God that he somehow helped Him to be great.

People who read Wilkinson's book, The Prayer Of Jabez, and follow his instr