Discussion

Home Newsletters Resources Discussion About Us

Bahá'í - Christian Dialogue Interest Group

Discussion

E-mail discussions of the Bahá'í-Christian Dialogue Interest Group take place on 'Bahá'í-Dialogue', which is an e-mail list available to all the interest groups of the Assocation for Bahá'í Studies Australia. Highlights of these discussions will be posted here from time to time.

Click here to find out how to join the discussion.

From John New (12 Jan. 1998)

Colin,

Happy (Gregorian calendar) New Year.

Thanks for the B/C Dialogue newsletter. This is/was a good idea. Did I
really say all that stuff you printed? Urk!

I've wondered from time to time where this little interest group should
go. The concept of such a group is good but you are quite right to ask
what it should work towards, what it should be doing, how it should
function, etc. At the moment it doesn't seem to have much momentum, it's
sort of like a bookmark waiting for things to happen. As always, lack of
time is a problem amidst other things such as family and work
responsibilities.

But you are also quite right to point out that groups such as this only
survive if people show interest. And to suggest a low-workload method as
the way forward.

The mission statement you have put together seems reasonable to me.

Is it worthwhile producing a list of people in this group, with email
addresses for those people who have them? This could make it seem more
like a cohesive group.

A web site is a good idea. This could even include a list of people in
the group. It could include links to useful sites, like the one you
mentioned in the newsletter. It could include articles (or links to
articles) written by members of the group. I might even consider
maintaining such a site, with your help, if the logistics could be worked
out. My internet account includes 1MB of free web space but I don't
think this would be enough to develop a B/C dialogue web site.

But I notice that if this group becomes "officially recognized" it has
access to resources such as a web site. Is this its own web site, where
the group can develop as it likes?

BTW, I don't understand what you mean when you say "the hardware ... is
presently unserviceable". Could you explain?

Writing articles, like the ones you have written, is good. I'm probably
speaking for myself here, but I'm a little nervous about writing because
I know there are many more scholarly people out there who have written
first-class papers. Maybe it's worthwhile suggesting that even very
short articles are fine, even 250-500 words, and that it's possible to
expand these later.

Preparing short talks in areas of interest (that could later develop into
articles) is a good idea. I imagine this means talks to other members of
this group as a starter.

I've mentioned this before but, personally, I can see scope in preparing a
short course on the Bahá'í Faith and/or Bahá'í/Christianity for delivery
at something like an evening college. From a Christian's pov, this would
be a little more than a 2-hour weekly Bible study. It could be done in
the context of discussing Christianity amidst a variety of world
religions, one or two weeks for each one. Our local evening college has a
course called Bible Discovery. I know nothing about it, but it's only 10
weeks so it's very low-key.

Also personally, I can see value in a church inviting in speakers from
different religion to various Bible study groups or at teaching weekends.
But I wouldn't have a clue how to promote this. I suspect that the church
I go to (evangelical Anglican) would be so narrow-minded that I would be
put on a black-list for even suggesting the idea. A Uniting church might
be more receptive. I think you would have to present the Bahá'í Faith in
the context of other world religions for an idea such as this to work
(partly because many Christians wouldn't have heard about Bahá'í).

An annual get-together is probably worthwhile. Perhaps for an afternoon
tea or bring-a-plate-for-lunch. Just a coordinator is probably
sufficient.

Hope these ideas are useful.

--John

From Gary Matthews ("Notes from Stonehaven" e-mail newsletter June 1997)

Recently there've been cryptic references, in e-mail discussion groups, to the "Gary Matthews method" for teaching Christians. Much as I appreciate the writers' intent, such terminology makes me flinch. Even if I had such a method -- and I don't -- I believe it's unwise to identify a teaching strategy with any specific individual (other than perhaps our Central Figures). I've watched this before; it's happened with certain "mass teaching" techniques, deepening practices and other methodologies. The result is predictable: A wonderful idea, evolving from the collective wisdom and experience of the Baha'i community, becomes frozen into someone's personal ideology. At that point the idea ceases to develop, adapt and incorporate fresh insights; efforts are made to apply it in situations where it doesn't belong; and people start taking sides about it. A once-useful tool becomes a point of disunity, so that it does more harm than good. Be that as it may, I repeat that there's _no such thing_ as a "Matthews method" of teaching Christians (or anyone else). I do have some views on this subject, views I've aired many times on Baha'i-Teachers and in other public forums. Lest someone think there's anything original, proprietary or even systematic about my ideas, here they are:

First, the only rule is that "there are no rules"! Christians are easily the most diverse population on earth, and anything we say that's right for one Christian is likely to be wrong for another. Memorizing a script, or following mechanically a "method", can never take the place of getting to know the individual we seek to teach. But if "methods", "rules", "systems" and the like are too rigid, there is a spiritual _attitude_ that makes effective Christian teaching possible. This attitude can be expressed in what I call "three guidelines and a theological principle".

The three guidelines are:

(a) listen and learn; (b) affirm and explain; and (c) truly love Christ and the Bible.

The theological principle is:

There is only one Christ.

In case they aren't self-evident, let's consider these points one at a time:

(a) Listen and Learn: Why is this step important? Because any given Christian probably knows things about Christianity that we don't. (Some know a _lot_ that we don't.) This includes those we may think of as "fundamentalists" or "literalists" -- their ranks include some very spiritual, very insightful and intelligent people. We needn't hesitate to listen, to ask questions, to draw them out and cultivate a sympathetic understanding of their views. Often we'll discover fascinating and useful information in this way. Another important benefit is that we'll better understand the thoughts and feelings of the person we seek to teach, so that we can better adapt our own presentation.

(b) Affirm and Explain: There's a strong temptation to respond to Christian arguments by saying, "That's wrong", or "We don't believe that". In most cases, this approach is needlessly confrontational. There is a "Baha'i way" of understanding -- and affirming -- virtually every traditional Christian belief: the inspiration of the Bible, the Sonship and Divinity of Christ, the Trinity, the Incarnation, the Atonement, the Resurrection, Satan, you name it. Whenever Christians advance such doctrines (or ask us for our views on them), we have two choices: One, we can pick a fight. Two, we can quote Baha'i scriptures which endorse the truth of the Bible teaching in question, and which demonstrate its correct interpretation. Which response will more likely gain a receptive hearing: "That's wrong; we don't believe that." Or: "You've expressed a most important Bible truth, one that we as Baha'is embrace completely. May I share with you how we understand and interpret this principle?" In the latter case, we emphasize our common commitment to Christ and the Bible: We are fellow-believers discussing a secondary question of meaning. Otherwise, we position ourselves as adversaries with nothing in common to talk about.

(c) Truly love Christ and the Bible. This is The Big One -- the tough one, because we can't fake it. We can cultivate this love; we can acquire it; but we can't fake it. If we don't express such an attitude, we won't succeed. But if we try to express it without really meaning it, our Christian contacts will see through us like glass. For this, they have x-ray vision, and we needn't try to kid anybody. The good news is that once we do acquire this love, and the reverence that goes along with it, we become entitled to a certain number of mistakes in applying the other guidelines. (I almost said "rules"...) Not, however, an unlimited number of mistakes. Which brings up the above-mentioned theological principle:

There is Only One Christ. I find that this principle always raises a certain number of Baha'i eyebrows. Don't we say there are lots of "Christs"? Don't we insist that Jesus Christ was simply "one among many"? Don't we say Christ was fine for His time, but that was then, and this is now, and so we need Baha'u'llah and His teachings to replace Christ and the Bible? Yes, we Baha'is say plenty of things like this, particularly to our Christian friends. And no matter what other wonderful things we may say, we seem always to bog down at this juncture in arguments about the uniqueness of Christ. By doing so, we miss Baha'u'llah's point regarding the oneness of the Manifestations. What we must see is that Christians who insist on the everlasting uniqueness and supremacy of Christ are correct -- in a very important sense. They didn't invent this principle: It is upheld both in the Bible and in the Baha'i teachings. Referring to Christ, the Bible says: "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God" (John 1:1). Elsewhere this "Word" (which the Bible says "was made flesh, and dwelt among us") is defined as a "quickening spirit" and as the "express image of the invisible God" (Heb. 1:3, Col. 1:15) -- an image we see reflected "as in a mirror" (II Cor. 3:18). In other words, when the Bible speaks of "Christ", it doesn't always refer to the historical human being known as Jesus of Nazareth: Often it means the preexistent Presence of God that became manifest _in_ Jesus. "...in this sense", says 'Abdu'l-Baha, "'Christ' is an expression of the Divine Reality, the simple Essence and heavenly Entity, which hath no beginning nor ending" (Baha'u'llah and the New Era, p. 207). In this sense, there is only one Christ -- eternally unique, unchanging, incomparable. In this sense, Christ is literally "the way, the truth and the life" and the "only way" to God. In this sense, "Christ" -- the preexistent Presence of God -- is manifest in Jesus, in Baha'u'llah, in all the Divine Messengers. These are different human individuals, but they all embody one "quickening spirit", and that spirit is the Eternal Christ. Most Christians, I find, intuitively understand this distinction between the Divine Christ (the indwelling Presence of God) and the human, historical Jesus. Many understand it in a very explicit and thoughtful way: It is, after all, standard Christian theology. Instead of trying to undermine or diminish their concept of Christ, we do better to expand their vision: Help them see that Christ -- this Divine Christ -- is even greater and more universal than they may have realized. If we confirm their belief in Christ, and explain it in this manner, we create a shared sense of commitment that is most attractive. And we demonstrate that boundless reverence for Christ in no way contradicts our belief in Baha'u'llah, or in progressive revelation. If we evince this attitude toward Christ (which is common to both the Bible and the Baha'i teachings); if we emphasize that in this sense, there is only one Christ -- it's often amazingly easy to reach agreement in principle regarding His nature and station. Not every Christian will agree with every word we say on this topic, but that's irrelevant. The point is that this familiar, easily understood perspective rarely takes Christians outside their comfort zone. And once we find common cause regarding the identity of Christ, it becomes possible to discuss freely all the other sticky issues that paralyze Baha'i-Christian dialog.

There, that's it. That basically everything I know (or at least think) about teaching Christians. This bridge-building approach certainly isn't mine: Each one of the guidelines is repeatedly emphasized in our Sacred Writings; all of them were perfectly exemplified and demonstrated by 'Abdu'l-Baha. This explanation of Christ was used not only by our Central Figures, but by most of the early great Baha'i pioneers and teachers such as Lua Getsinger. I learned it from Winston Evans, Marzieh Gail and many other outstanding Baha'i teachers. It has been expounded in our day, with brilliant scholarship, by Michael Sours, Dann J. May, Brent Poirier and a host of other Baha'i writers. But I can't shake the funny feeling that none of us, so far, have really figured this thing out -- not completely. Insofar as this model (or strategy or whatever we call it) works, fine. But we need to express it in countless ways, augment it with fresh insights and experiences from many other teachers, adapt it to novel situations. It needs to evolve over time. Please God, we'll soon look back at the description I've outlined above, and laugh at how naive and simplistic it was, considering how much better we then understand the spiritual dynamic. When that day comes, I'm praying that my own current exposition won't be remembered (and thereby fossilized) as the "Matthews Method". Who wants to go down in history as a quaint laughing-stock? Not this kid...

From Dale Grider (A Christian with a Christian-Bahá'í Dialogue web site), posted to another discussion list:

Dear Bahá'í brother,
    The Fireside Letters is a website of vital importance to the Bahá'í
mandate to "independently investigate" for truth. In its present "book"
type format it will admitedly involve the patience of a true seeker
willing to spend the time to read it. I am certainly open for
suggestions that might improve the palatability of the very important
information that is there. But I suppose I have expected that Bahá'ís,
more than most, should be expected to be hungry do absorb and digest any
information that helps clarify their perspective.This seems a vital part
of Bahá'í belief. Thoroughly legitimate study in any investigation that
is genuine, actually rests more critically upon full consideration of
opposing viewpoints and perspectives than it does confirming ideas. One
must be able to consider how opposing concepts might, or might not,
genuinely bear upon one's present level of understanding and belief.
Then one can honestly grow in understanding from a genuinely informed
vantage point. The old saying is that one can "miss the forest for the
trees". One can be too close and involved in what one assumes to be true
making one's willingness to step back and see ideas in a larger context
absolutely critical.
    I would think, at any rate, that the introduction at the beginning of
volume 1 would be enough of a "teaser" to get the spiritual seeker
interested. For myself, the reading takes off if one can just get
started (that is, if one has a genuine interest in the considerations
and issues that face the Bahá'í adherent as he or she confronts the
Christian perspective.) But how could a Bahá'í be anything less than
anxiously interested in such consideration? As the bedrock dogma exists
within Bahá'í theology that all major religions are really the same at
their root level and differences are either only trivial or illusory
("seeming" as Bahá'í writers allege), then the Fireside Letters exist as
an imperative consideration, whether in a passively "easy" format, or
one that takes some work and reading.
    Perhaps the person visiting the site could be advised to copy and paste
volumes into their Word Processing application to be printed out or read
at leisure off line? I have often done this in many instances with
lengthy Bahá'í writings like Some Answered Questions, and Gleanings from
the Writings of Baha'u'llah. The library I have built in my own "search"
for truth consists as much or more of opposing viewpoints that I have
worked through as affirming ones. Through facing and investiagting such
considerations comes true growth. Another cliche' that comes to mind
says something about the wasted energy of "preaching to the choir"
(those already of like mind who will not provide the opportunity for you
to test your ideas).
    Please reconsider spending some time reading through the volumes. I
know that you will discover some considerations that have never occured
to you (and didn't to me either until the engaging discussion that is
the Fireside Letters transpired).
    In another vein I am interested in further critical input from Bahá'ís
and have every expectation that editing and growth toward clarity of the

Bahá'í perspective can come from input from folks like yourself. In that
sense my invitiation is one that provides the Bahá'í community a chance
to shape to some extent just what the Fireside Letters consists of. My
search for truth is certainly still evolving.
    Please refer others to the site and invite them as well to offer
critical feedback which will be taken in a spirit of peace and the quest
for truth.

The URL for the Firside Letters is;
http://personal.sdf.bellsouth.net/sdf/h/o/howdybud/FS%20website/index%20.html

Thanks,
Dale:)